Monday, October 7, 2013

Fish Bowl #7, Chapters 22-23 of The Kite Runner

 

Welcome to your seventh fish bowl!

A few reminders if you're looking for an A for the day:

(A) Bring at least one quotation and/or page reference into at least one of your responses.
(B) Explain your thinking thoughtfully and thoroughly (try to avoid the one-sentence response).
(C) Keep it professional, including the usage of proper grammar and spelling.
(D) Comment frequently from the beginning of the conversation to the end.


Remember also that you're welcome to get into a hot seat in the inner circle for a little while and earn some of your daily participation points there.

112 comments:

  1. Why does Amir think it may have been a mistake to stop acting like a coward?

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    1. When he was about to meet with the official, he knew somthing bad was going to happen.

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    2. Because Amir being a coward has lead to many things including the ending of Hassan and Amir's relationship.

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    3. He feels that just simply convincing Assef with words may have been more effective than trying to stand up to him. P. 284 "I wished I could take them back. Swallow them. But they were ou. I had crossed a line, and whatever little hope I had of getting out alive had vanished with those words." Amir stood up to Assef and he knew before he had finished saying those words that it was a mistake.

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  2. On page 302 when it say, "Amir the socially legitimate half, the half that represented the riches he had inherited and the sin with impunity privileges that came with them". What sins do you think that Amir inherited?

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    1. Amir had always had everything given to him. When the Russians came he was confused because he and Baba fled and he no longer had all the luxuries he was used to. It may have been a sin for Amir to allow himself to be treated like royalty and get always get away with what Assef may call "sinning".

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  3. on page 289 "what was so funny was that, for the first time since the winter of 1975, i felt at peace. I laughed because i saw that, in some hidden nook in the corner of my mind, i'd even been looking forward to this." what exactly is this quote saying?

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  4. Were you surprised to discover that the official was Assef?

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    1. No, because the way he talked about the Hazara's, and how mean he was to different people. It was like the author made it to were Assef had to join the Taliban.

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    2. Not really, I feel like the author set up the book so that we would see more of him, and we talked about it during the last seminar.

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    3. I was surprised, but at the same time it didn't surprise me that he was in the Taliban because earlier in the book they talked a lot about how Assef hated the Hazaras, so in the end I wasn't really surprised.

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    4. Earlier in the book there was foreshadowing when Assef told Amir that he hated Hazaras, and that he was going to have a future that involved him acting upon that, and now he is doing exactly what he said he would do: killing Hazaras. He idolized Hitler and now he is acting upon that idolization.

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    5. No, Assef seemed hate the Hazzaras more than enough to go to that extent. Meaning I wouldn't have doubted for a moment that Assef would turn out as a dictating leader of some sort.

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  5. I think Amir will forgive himself for Hassan because taking care of his child is the best that he can do for Hassan now. I think that Amir has shown that he is a hero in these two chapters because he took a beating to allow srorhab to escape and he then passes out once he gets out. and he did all of this for someone hes barely even related to.

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  6. I think they still would have stayed in Afghanistan and if the talaban hadnt of come i still think they Hazarras would be prosecuted because even before that people thought that they did not belong.

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  7. I believe that Amir can forgive himself to his own brother, Hassan, because he is searching for forgiveness by confronting Assef. Assef appears in Chapter 22 and he is an official of the Taliban.

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  8. On page 298 Amir says "Thank you Shorab you also saved my life." What does he mean by this? And also how will Shorab take Amir saying this.

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    1. It shows a deeper connection between them that they will not be able to shake off. Amir means that Sohrab opened his eyes to what he needed to do in his life and now he has the ability to forgive himself. Sohrab will now know who his family is and this will allow Sohrab to love Amir like a father and therefore finally redeem Amir for his past.

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  9. Amir said that "...for the first time since winter of 1975, I felt at peace". (289) He felt at peace because he felt that he was getting what he deserved. After all of those years of hurting Hassan, karma finally got him. He was starting to feel better. Now that this was happening to him, perhaps he could let go of some of his guilt. Or maybe he felt that Assef didn't have anything against Hassan if he was hurting him as well?

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    1. I think some of the guilt will go away but without Hassan there to truly forgive him, I feel he will never truly be at peace. How do you think this situation would have turned out if Hassan was there? Do you think he would have helped Amir? or left him just like Amir did in 1975?

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  10. "After all these years. His name escaped my lips: "Assef"" what is the significance of this quote and why would the author choose to put this character back into the book?

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    1. This is showing how Amir had forgotten about Assef, and now describes the shock and horror he has from seeing him again. It was also used to shock the reader and make the reader think deeper about the importance of Assef's return in the book.

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  11. Do you think Hassef will show up in the story again? If so will Amir kill him?

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    1. Yes he shows up on page 281 and then they have a battle that could connect to the characteristic "Battle with the Dragon".

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    2. No I think Amir has a soft heart even though he has seen death and violence his heart is still noble.

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  12. On page 302 when it say, "Amir the socially legitimate half, the half that represented the riches he had inherited and the sin with impunity privileges that came with them". i think it means that he is taking the sins and fears that others have and taking them on his own'

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    1. good job copying and paste off of dokota

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  13. When Assef is beating Amir, Amir says "he feels relieved", Do you think this is finally the redemption he needed to forgive himself? So you think if Hassan was alive that this would give the two of them a chance at redeeming their long lost friendship?

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  14. I think that all these scenes of violence really reflect on this moment through the book. Amir has so much anger built up for Assef, witnessing a rape and seeing so much violence. Chapter 22 was very important in this novel.

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    1. I agree, I feel that chapter 22 was the most important chapter of the whole book because everything is tied together. Amir feels truly at peace, finally he can feel happy again. After everything that has happened in his past he has a chance to feel the way he felt before the winter of 1975.

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  15. On page 289 Amir says "The harder I laughed the harder he kicked me, I was laughing because I finally got what I deserve." This is showing how Amir has not forgot about the past with Hassan, but he has felt better about it.

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    1. On that same page Assef asks Amir twice, "WHATS SO FUNNY?" I personally think that Amir was being forgiven from Hassan and is seems that he is enjoying is.

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    2. I agree he is kind of like taking pay back on what Assef did to Hassan.

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    3. Do you think though that If Hassan was alive that he would have wished this upon Amir? Because even after the rape happened,Hassan remained loyal to Amir. Loyalty goes a long way ans I personally think this would have ended differently if Hassan had the chance to tell Amir how he feels after all those years.

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  16. When baba mutters: "Ive been away for a long time" I believe he's reflecting upon his past and how much he's been through, I think its his way of admitting that he is very tired from traveling.

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  17. I also believe that Amir took the beating instead of Sorhab because Amir needs Hassan to forgive him and he is dead so that is hard. In this case I believe that the only way Amir can be forgive him, is if he forgives himself. Hassan can not forgive him, for he is dead, so this is a self forgiveness situation. If he forgives himself, Hassan will forgive him. Also, Hassan was a servant to Amir and was extremely hospitable to him,and really nice, why wouldn't Hassan still have those traits or characteristics.
    Also, I predicted that Assef was going to be the leader of the Taliban because he thought of himself as Hitler in the early Chapters confronting him.

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  18. Irony is a big part of the book because when he goes to meet the official on page 281 " his name escaped my lips: Assef" this is very ironic because i think Amir wanted to never see Assef again in his life and now he as to negotiate with him to get what he needs

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  19. On pg. 282 it says, "And was this really happening? Was I really sitting across from Assef?". Do you think that Amir is worried that Assef will do something similar to what he did to Hassan to Amir?

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    1. I just think he fears death. I think he knows anything could happen, but he really just wants to get Sohrab and get out of there.

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    2. I don't think so, if Assef does anything to Amir brutally he will either beat him or kill him, I don't think he will want to take away his dignity.

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  20. On page 309 Amir says "Baba marinating lamb for my thirteenth birthday part. Soraya and I making love for the first time, the sun rising in the east, our ears still ringing from the wedding music, and her henna-painted hands laced in mine." Why do you think Amir is remembering the past? Is is because he's not sure if these are going to be his last good memories? Is this his way of embarrassing death?

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  21. On page 282-283 Why do you think that the Parchami soldiers started taking rich people and throwing them in jail for no reason as it says, "when a group of Parchimi soldiers marched into our house and ordered my father and me at gun point to follow them. The bastards didn't give a reason".

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  22. Do you think the Taliban will come after Amir, or will Amir walk away safely?

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    1. I think they will come after Amir because knowing Assef he will not let him get away.

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    2. I think that they will come after Amir as well but if Amir is smarter he will try and get away and maybe go to the U.S

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    3. The Taliban will come after Amir I think.

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  23. On page 298 Amir says "Thank you Shorab you also saved my life." how did he save his life what came about that caused him to say this and why

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  24. On page 308 it says "you can hardly walk." this really shows the utter violence that people in modern Afghanistan see on a daily basis.

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  25. I feel like chapter 22 is the beginning of the falling action because they found out that assef is the leader of the talibans

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  26. What is the signifihance of Assef telling Amir that he was imprisoned and when they kept kicking him it made him feel better and when Assef was beating Amir he felt "healed" also, "My body was broken-just how badly I wouldn't find out until later- but I felt healed. Healed at last. I laughed."

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    1. I think it is significant because he tells us what Assef did and what happened so he could be apart of this government. I think he felt healed because of what he saw as a kid, the rape. He feels healed because he can't ask for forgiveness now, because Hassan is dead. But now, Assef beating him, he feels better now because of what had happen when they were kids.

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  27. on pg. 281 there is a really real sense of fear being portrayed through this page, from when amir first looked at assef he felt cold, shamed and scared. He was reminded of that horrible day when hassan was raped.

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  28. I think, if the Taliban did not come into Afghanistan, the Hazara's would still be looked down on, but not as bad as the Taliban did, by just killing them in the streets for no reason at all, except that they are a different race.

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  29. Is Amir more like Baba now because of his bravery?

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    1. i think that he is brave, but I don't think that he is brave in the same way Baba was. I think that Amir has to be brave in different kinds of situations then Baba did.

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  30. Do you think that Amir and Assef fighting helped Amir finally get over all of his guilt of letting what Hassan happen to him? And also what affect did saving Hassan's son have on his recovery process?

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    1. I think that if Hassan can forgive Amir if Sorhab, his son forgives Amir. Amir also has to forgive himself before he can move on.

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    2. I think that Amir fighting Assef really took all of the anger out of Amir and Amir just went Ape on him and the guilt may of stopped a little but not completely disappeared because Amir needs forgiveness from Hassan, not to just get payback.

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    3. Yes I do think that getting beat by Assef does make Amir less guilty for Hassan. I think that saving Hassan's son will fix his guilt entirely.

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  31. We already know that Amir and Hassan have never liked each other or gotten along. Do you think this will impact the negotiations between the two? Do you think Assef will do something bad to Amir? Do you think that Amir will seek revenge upon Assef?

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    1. Yes i do believe they will encounter each other again and there will be a fight.

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  32. I wonder why amir was still a bit scared when seeing assef after all this time? I think he just still hadn't outlived the day enough to forget that it had happened, and so he was still reminded of it and that made him weak.

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  33. I think even if there was a government the prosecution would still happen against the Hazarras because the entire population is against them and really dont like them. i dont think anything would stop the prosecution of them

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  34. I predict that Amir will take Sorab home with him and Soroya.

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  35. Do you think that with Amir trying to stop this now that he is in the position to this is "His way of being good again"? If so why?

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    1. I think that this could be his way of trying to get forgiveness because he was laughing so he knew that this was the way of getting redemption from Hassan.

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  36. A quote that stands out to me would be After Assef had badly beaten up Amir in their fight to see who would get to keep Sohrab he was taken to the hospital to recieve proper care for his injuries. Amir was unable to recall anything that hteappened during the fight, and Dr.Faruqi explained what had happened to him. One thing that happened during the brawl left Amir speechless. He thinks to himself, “I kept thinking of something else Armand/Dr. Faruqi had said: The impact had cut your upper lip in two, he had said, clean down the middle. Clean down the middle. Like a harelip.” This really amazed me to think that after fighting to remove his guilt and clean his conscience in the fight for Hassan’s son, he had ended up a survivor, but with an injury resembling the looks of the person he was redeeming himself for.

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    1. I think meant that Amir and Hassan were finally together. They spent so many years together and when it ended, it ended on a bad note. Now Amir has Hassans son and took the beating he never got. The harelip resembled how finally Hassan and Amir were symbolically together.

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  37. "WHATS SO FUNNY" Assef kept roaring with each blow." In this quote it shows that he finally thinks that he got what he deserves because he is the one that is getting beaten instead of Hassan.

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  39. When Assef says he is on a mission to rid of Afghanistan garbage, what does he mean?

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    1. This means, Assef is trying to get rid of all the non-true Afghans. Like the Hazara's. So I think Assef was fine with Amir taking Sohrab, if he got out of that room alive, which he did.

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  40. Do you think that with Assef getting shot in the eye it is implying the term "Eye for and eye"?

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    1. I think that it was a ironic event and it proves that karma always comes around.

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    2. I do, and also I believe that it ties back to the point in the book where Hassan told Assef that people would call him one-eye Assef because he was going to shoot his left eye out. #Like Father-Like Son

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    3. No, I just think it makes Asseff appears more as a monster rather than a human being. It shows that he got shot in the eye and lived. Who's probably raped more boys and girls than just Hassan, so I don't believe that he lost his eye because of Hassan.

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    4. I agree with this saying "eye for an eye" because as Assef caused fear and hurtfulness to Hassan he got what he deserved by getting shot in the eye.

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  41. On page 285 when Assef says, "Ethnic Cleansing. I like it. I like the sound of it." It shows that Assef has not changed in the time that Amir has been away from him. This quote is significant because it shows that Assef is the same bad person who raped Hassan early in the book.

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  42. Amirs split lip represents irony again because Hassan had that when he was a kid before the surgery to fix it. It shows a little bit of a connection to Hassan and Amir because this only happened because Amir was trying to save Hassans son

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  43. On page 289 Amir says "I don't know at what point I started laughing, but I did. It hurt to laugh, hurt my jaws, my ribs, my throat. But I was laughing and laughing. And the harder I laughed, the harder he kicked me, punched me scratched me." Do you think that Amir started laughing because Amir set himself in Hassans shoes and just thought to himself how bad Hassan got it and what he's getting right now is nothing compared to what Hassan got.

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  44. What do you think will happen to Amir and Sorab later in the book?

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    1. I predict that Amir will take Sorab home with him.

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  45. I think this book is really starting to come to a close and the events are really heating up, I predict that this novel will have a very unexpected end.

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  46. When amir chose to leave, where is he planning on going? I think he's going to go someplace unfamiliar to stay unnoticed, he can finally go and forgive himself for his cowardice

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  47. Do all of the people that are helping Amir after he gets beaten show how much the people do not like the Taliban?

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  48. I think that Amir was laughing when he was getting beat because these brass knuckles are built up to be these terrible terrible things but although it still hurts a lot the pain is worth it so that sohrab can escape to freedom. Another reason i think that he is laughing is that he is laughing about how sohrab is getting away and Assef cant have her anymore making his mission a success.

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  49. Amir wants to be Sorabs friend because Sorab is much like Hassan. On page 304 he said he wanted to be friends with Sorab, and he put his arm on his shoulders.

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  50. Again violence takes place in these chapter. Why do you believe that the author incorporates so much violence into this book, and what does it signify in this book? Would the story be the same without all of the violence?

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    1. It signify s that the closer Amir gets to his past in Afghanistan, more violence occurs. The story would be very different without the violence, and people would be happy about the Taliban.

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    2. The meaning behind all the violence in this book is that, no matter where you go, you will always find violence. One day violence will come to you. Some people will have the power of bringing violence to you while you are most vonlarable.

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  51. I feel that now almost everyone close to him is dead, this is when Amir rises and forgives himself for the past. Also this is when Amir becomes a true hero.

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  52. Do you think Amir can finally forgive himself now that he has Hassans son?

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  53. Amir finally got what he deserved, and he will feel much better about him self, but he will still feel guilt, and he cant overcome that guilt.

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  54. What do you think the significance of this quote is? “We’re the same, you and I. You nursed with him, but you’re my twin.” (p.307).

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  55. “I kept thinking of something else Armand/Dr. Faruqi had said: The impact had cut your upper lip in two, he had said, clean down the middle. Clean down the middle. Like a harelip.” i think this is sad but kind of ironic in its own way

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  56. Will Amir be relieved of his consciousness? I think amir will have to first forgive his sins before he can accept who he really is, and once he does that his consciousness will be relieved.

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  57. "Assef said behind us, "I didn't say you could take him for free". (pg 286) This quote shows that he was not going to get the boy back easy.

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  58. Will Amir become a hero, or is he just looking for forgiveness.

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    1. I think that Amir will get both I think that he will get forgiveness and he will be a hero in the eyes of some of the people.

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  59. Amir's call to Action in Chapter 22 when he fights Assef I believe he is not a hero yet. He needs to do more and bring Sorhab back to America.

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  60. How exactly do you think this book is going to end because events keep a curing and i think something big is going to happen.

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    1. I agree with you something big is going to happen that will conclude the story, there has been some foreshadowing of rescuing Hassan's son and helping him become good.

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  61. In response to Eli's question of how big of an impact religion had on the book, I don't think that religion ha an impact on the plot, but i think it is a very big part of the lives of people living in the middle east. Other than the Islamic extremists who are in the Taliban, religion was not a big impact on the story.

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  62. Could Amirs attitude through out the book like being a coward and wanting to run away from his problems, be causing all of his problems?

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  63. Do you think at the end of the book assef is going to die?

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    1. I don't think that he will die, bit I think that he will somehow be punished for hat he has done.

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  64. On page 284 it says "A look of surprise passed across Assef's face, briefly, and disappeared. 'I see this may be enjoyable after all,' he said, snickering. 'But there are things traitors like you don't understand.'" Why do you think that Assef views Amir as a traitor? What will he not understand?

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    1. I think he views Amir as a traitor because Amir left and went to America while his home country was destroyed by war. I don't know what Assef meant when he said you don't understand but I feel like Amir and Assef meeting once again will tie up the story

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  65. "When its all done, only one of us will walk out of this room alive," Assef Said." (pg 287) Why do you think that Assef would want to fight him?

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